Noisy/whining transmission

My first 2005 ST that I bought in 2009, I just had to touch everything on it, including the counter balancers.
The second 2005 ST that I bought, I only touched the items that pertained to regular maintenance.
I would suggest you check the counterbalance shaft settings, as the previous owner may have adjusted them incorrectly.
Take a sample of oil and send it in to see if there is any metals in it from worn gears from the transmission.
 
Marico said:
Hello,
I bought a 2009 ST1300 with 23k miles on the clock. Unfortunately, due to some unfavorable circumstances, I didn’t do a test ride at speeds over 40 mph before buying it. After the purchase, I discovered that at speeds over 40 mph, there’s a sound that resembles an overloaded drivetrain (similar to the whining you sometimes hear from the rear axle of a truck). A few days earlier, I tested another ST1300 with similar mileage, and it didn’t make that sound.
How is it possible that with such low mileage, this kind of noise is present? Is this a common issue? What usually causes it?
Below is a recording — you can hear the whining once it goes over 2500 RPM

YouTube

Click to expand...
The video is inconsistent. I hear a howl that I think the poster is describing, but when he shifts, he stops accelerating and the noise stops. That would lead one to think the noise is dependent on an engine load being present, indicating a driveline issue, but again, it is hard to tell from that short vid. I think a better video, with a longer run, while accelerating most of the time would help. OP, if you ride along and roll the throttle on and off, does the noise come and go in time with the throttle?
 
Driving the rear wheel through the transmission with the bike on the center stand may introduce new 'bad' noises as the various gear to gear lash present throughout the transmission, shaft, and final drive in a normal machine are not damped by load.
 
I corrected the balancer shafts (they were a bit tight), but as expected, it didn't change anything.
I drove a couple of miles and my observations are as follows:
  • The sound pitch is not directly correlated to engine RPMs — only to the speed.
  • It doesn’t matter which gear I'm in; the pitch always stays the same and only changes when the speed changes. The sound becomes noticeable at around 30 mph, and by 50 mph it’s already quite loud. The sound resembles an old, overloaded truck driving in first gear at high engine revs — that typical howl of a heavily loaded gearbox. Further acceleration increases the overall noise (mostly wind), making it harder to distinguish the sound from the general background noise.
  • When I pull the clutch, the volume of the sound drops, but it remains barely audible.
  • As the bike slows down (with the clutch pulled), the pitch lowers as well.

Happy Easter!
 
At this point, if it were me, I would be changing out the rearend fluid and having a look at the old fluid. If you have no idea of the age of the fluid, it should be changed anyway. Remember to remove the fill plug first before removing the drain plug.
 
dduelin said:
Driving the rear wheel through the transmission with the bike on the center stand may introduce new 'bad' noises as the various gear to gear lash present throughout the transmission, shaft, and final drive in a normal machine are not damped by load.
Click to expand...
I just did such test on the center stand (with rear break to simulate load). Wining/howling is definitely coming from the engine side not the rear wheel and the sound suddenly becomes significantly noticeable above ~30mph.

Bmacleod said:
At this point, if it were me, I would be changing out the rearend fluid and having a look at the old fluid. If you have no idea of the age of the fluid, it should be changed anyway. Remember to remove the fill plug first before removing the drain plug
Click to expand...

The first thing I did was replace all the fluids, except for the coolant for now.
 
Marico said:
I just did such test on the center stand (with rear break to simulate load). Wining/howling is definitely coming from the engine side not the rear wheel and the sound suddenly becomes significantly noticeable above ~30mph.
Click to expand...
Guess you did not try the stethoscope to pinpoint the source of the noise. That might have reduced our speculation...and the fun of diagnosing something far removed from us.:biggrin:
 
I didn't use a stethoscope because, honestly, what difference would it make to pinpoint the exact location in the engine? Every spot in an engine means a fairly complex repair. When I started this thread, maybe a bit naively, I was hoping it could just be the final drive, since that doesn’t require disassembling or dismantling the engine... Even though I’m an engineer (not a mechanical one), and I can handle simple repairs myself, I probably wouldn’t take on fixing such a big engine due to my lack of experience (I did once replace a piston and rings in a KZ200, but that doesn’t really count). Well, it looks like I’ll have to rely on a good mechanic who knows these engines well.

Of course, there's always the option to sell it on, but I don't think it would be entirely honest to let someone walk into a trap like that.

Willsmotorcycle said:
Insert audio recording here.
Click to expand...


But I have to admit that in these "static" conditions, the sound is more subtle than what you feel while driving. I'm pretty sure someone will say it's normal gearbox noise :) . But honestly, during driving, it's irritating and really draws attention, especially considering that just a few days earlier, I had been driving another st1300 and it didn’t make that kind of sound.
Because of the brake's behavior, I had to constantly adjust the revs, trying to keep them more or less at a consistent level.
 
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Marico said:
But I have to admit that in these "static" conditions, the sound is more subtle than what you feel while driving.
Click to expand...

I had a similar noise once (not on a ST) and it was a bearing.

Like yours, it was also noisier under load.

If you haven't drained the oil yet, you may want to do it and check for metallic particles, and maybe gut the filter as well to check it.
 
MidLife said:
I had a similar noise once (not on a ST) and it was a bearing.

Like yours, it was also noisier under load.

If you haven't drained the oil yet, you may want to do it and check for metallic particles, and maybe gut the filter as well to check
Click to expand...
I drained oil, I didn't find any visible metal particles—only on the oil drain plug tip there was a small buildup of what seemed like residue or sludge.
 
Al Gully said:
Like I said before, take an oil sample and send it in.
Then get back to us.
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IMHO oil condition diagnostics are useful for the early detection of potential issues—before we even know they're coming. In this case, however, we already know there's a problem...
 
Al Gully said:
Awesome, now run it like you stole it. :rofl1:
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Oh c'mon. It wasn't much—I picked it out with a screwdriver from inside the oil drain plug. There's a little recess there, which I believe contains a magnet. I think no one had ever cleaned out the buildup that had been collecting there over the years. And really, it wasn’t a lot—just as much as could fit inside that little cavity.
 
Marico said:
I didn't use a stethoscope because, honestly, what difference would it make to pinpoint the exact location in the engine?
Click to expand...
Well, not knowing exactly where the noise originates certainly would have deprived us of some entertainment guessing what is causing it. :biggrin: However, had you that knowledge you could make an informed decision whether to repair it or not, and how expensive it might be. Replacing the U joint is not a huge deal, replacing the engine is.

I paid my dealer north of $650 after his mechanic guessed at the source of a 'clunk' when I shifted. The mechanic put the bike together improperly and produced a clutch rattle. An independent mechanic went over the bike with said stethoscope and identified the clutch noise as well as the 'clunk'. I replaced the final drive myself (used from eBay for $100) and no more 'clunk'. The independent tech fixed the clutch issue. Knowledge is power.
 
Marico said:
  • The sound pitch is not directly correlated to engine RPMs — only to the speed.

Happy Easter!
Click to expand...

On the engine/transmission side, the transmission output shaft is the one component with RPMs matching the speed, so the issue could also be around the output shaft gear hub.

I don't remember reading here about having to swap this component, however, it is available on the web, which is sometimes an indication that there are riders who may have to replace it.

www.ebay.com

2005 03-17 HONDA ST1300A ST1300 OUTPUT SHAFT DRIVE GEAR HUB OEM TRANMISSION | eBay

OFFICE USE: LTR-RP 2005HONDAST1300-01166. ITEM MUST BE FULLY INSPECTED AND YOU MUST TAKE FULL RESPONSIBILITY/Liability before installation.
www.ebay.com

I have no idea what it takes to get to it (dropping the engine or not). In case it can be accessed "just" by pulling the shaft, there is a great write up from @4jranch here.

Article [13] - ST1300 - U-Joint Removal and Replacement | ST1300 Articles

U-Joint Removal and Replacement First let me say that there is lots of information on the site for this job. I read all that I could find as well as the manual before I attempted this. I decided in advance to try to take photos to document the process for any that might want to try this...
www.st-owners.com www.st-owners.com

Good pointer also from Dave @dduelin about using your foot as a stethoscope:

dduelin said:
....a seasoned Honda tech ....told me to place the heel of my boot against the RH step plate and you can feel for drive train vibrations during different drive train loads.
Click to expand...
 
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