Ran out of gas??

[DesmoRonin]

I can count the times I've run out of gas due to judgement error on one hand.

I was riding home from the office (about 7 miles one-way). As I left the stoplight on a moderate ascent, the bike simply stalled. Thinking I was stupidly in the wrong gear, I quickly attempted to correct, but the bike would not start. I was in a dangerous spot but managed to get out of harm's way quickly enough. Pushing 750+ lbs. uphill is not fun, lol. But then come to think about it, minus 7 gallons of gas meant it was less. I typically do not ride until the LFL illuminates and it came on a day earlier on the way home with about 230 miles on the trip meter. I figured I had 30-40 miles before I completely ran out and had only ridden around 10 miles when I ran out of gas. I've noticed that my fuel gauge reads completely empty at around 175-ish miles on the tripmeter. Anyone have a similar issue?

 

[Uncle Phil]

It can be tricky - I always assume I have about 20 miles when the light comes on (err on the side of caution).
With fuel that low and if the hill is steep enough, the fuel may can 'run away' from the pickup.
Best I can 'calculate' on most ST1100s you have about a gallon+- left when the light comes on but this can vary from bike to bike.
And how much of that is 'usable' remains to be seen (I've not done any testing at that point).
Also, you may have encountered the old 'early fuel pump' failure when the gas gets low enough, the pump heats up and quits pumping.
Then when you fill her back up and she starts working just fine (BTDTGTTS - several of them - I now travel with a spare on long trips).
Do you still have the fuel cutoff valve on there?
Could the filter be a bit 'clogged'?

 

[DesmoRonin]

Thank you Uncle Phil! I've finally ridden the bike long enough to figure I'm averaging around 30mpg overall. I've been trying to go easier on the throttle to see if I can improve this. When I saw 229 on the tripmeter when the LFL came on (only the second time ever for me), I thought, "Success! I have about a gallon left so I may finally be able to achieve 250 miles on a tank of gas." Apparently, I was wrong. I only made it to about 239 before stalling.

The hill wasn't steep at all, but I will certainly keep this in mind. And I will certainly try to find out which fuel pump I have. As much as I had hoped I would be further along my resto/repair/modify journey, I've been spending more time riding (and troubleshooting intermittent headlight and turnsignal cutting out and occasional start switch failure) so I haven't yet looked into cutoff valve or fuel filter. Otherwise, the bike has been running great!

 

[dwalby]

even in town I typically average 40mpg or so, 30mpg means there's something not quite right in your fuel delivery.

I don't know how closely the fuel gauges match from unit to unit, but on mine I have about 1 gallon of riding left when the needle lines up with the leftmost arc line at the "E" end of the gauge. That corresponds to about 6 gallons consumed out of 7.4 in the tank. That gives me 1 more gallon of riding, with about 0.4-ish left in the tank for margin. I don't pay attention to the low fuel light much, I go by the gauge.

On mine, when completely empty the fuel gauge aligns with the lower left corner of the "E", but I haven't done that in many years. I ran it empty one time just to see how low the gauge would go and I was never more than a couple hundred yards from a gas station. I pushed it that one time on level ground and it wasn't too bad, but after learning the fuel consumption history I never ran it that low again.

edit: it was 1997 when I did that, but if my memory is correct I think I put 7.2 gallons back in the tank when I ran it completely empty. I think the other 0.2 gallons is not accessible because of fuel pump not being able to completely empty the tank.

 

[Larry Fine]

My 1300 ran out warming up on the side-stand while showing 33 miles available.

I gave it about a quart of non-E regular and drove straight to the Amoco to fill up.

 

[DesmoRonin]

Once I get

even in town I typically average 40mpg or so, 30mpg means there's something not quite right in your fuel delivery.

I don't know how closely the fuel gauges match from unit to unit, but on mine I have about 1 gallon of riding left when the needle lines up with the leftmost arc line at the "E" end of the gauge. That corresponds to about 6 gallons consumed out of 7.4 in the tank. That gives me 1 more gallon of riding, with about 0.4-ish left in the tank for margin. I don't pay attention to the low fuel light much, I go by the gauge.

On mine, when completely empty the fuel gauge aligns with the lower left corner of the "E", but I haven't done that in many years. I ran it empty one time just to see how low the gauge would go and I was never more than a couple hundred yards from a gas station. I pushed it that one time on level ground and it wasn't too bad, but after learning the fuel consumption history I never ran it that low again.

Thank you for your advice. Once I get a free weekend, I'm hoping to start digging into the ST a bit more. I bought it moderately used, and though I haven't had any issues that have caused me great concern, I do know that it is not as sorted as it should be. This is the second time the LFL has come on for me, and it was intentional on my part to establish a baseline. I'm not one to follow my nose, but it does appear to be running slightly rich, so perhaps you're onto something here. An autopsy is in order in the near future. I do admit that I'm a bit throttle happy at times, but I do feel that I should be getting better fuel economy. Historically, I do get a little less than average on most of the bikes I've owned.

My 1300 ran out warming up on the side-stand while showing 33 miles available.

I gave it about a quart of non-E regular and drove straight to the Amoco to fill up.

Was it a one-time thing, or did you change the point at which you subsequently filled up?

 

[ST Gui]

At a gas station I was down to one bar. The gas cap dogs died and locked my gas cap with the key in it. I managed to gently snap off my key in the gas cap. At that time I didn't carry a spare.
Lesson #1 learned — always carry a spare.

I had to push my bike back to work a block away where a buddy showed up with my spare key.
Lesson #2 learned — never run out of gas.

Yes I know the one bar had nothing to do with the key snapping. Lesson #2 was about realizing that getting down to one bar was not a really accurate indicator of Bingo fuel — just that 1 bar is a LOT less than 3-8 and that pushing an ST even with an empty tank is not high on my ToDo list.

I ran out of gas once in my car and glided dead-stick off a freeway into a gas station right up to a pump. I still laugh when I think about that. Ran out of gas maybe three or four times on my 305 Scrambler. Then I decided to switch the petcock from RES to ON as soon as I was at the pump and not when I was finished fueling. Otherwise I might get distracted and forget to switch back to ON.

So I top off at 3 bars or as close to it as possible. If I'm headed back to the barn/RTB then I leave it at 2-3 bars. Much easier to get it on the center stand. Tires are usually over 42lbs at that point so it helps too.

 

[Uncle Phil]

30 MPG is pretty low for a ST1100 even if you are on throttle a lot.
You might see that if you run with the 'choke' (fuel enricher) on after she warms up but that is unusual.
I'm with Doug - something is going on with the pump/fuel cut off/carbs, etc.
You might pull one or two of your spark plugs and see what color they are.
From experience, if it has an aftermarket fuel pump most of them put out way too much pressure for the ST1100.
I had to put a regulator (one is built into the stocker) on mine and set it to about 1.5 to 2 PSI (seemed to be the sweet spot).
The best way to see is if she will start in the cold without the 'choke' - if so you've generally got too much fuel pressure.
And it will eventually override the carb floats.

 

[Joeywhat]

I was getting 40 mpg pretty religiously on my 1100, and I don't ride particularly slow and easy.

My 1300 shows around 40 on the dash but I haven't had a chance yet to confirm.

 

[Larry Fine]

Was it a one-time thing, or did you change the point at which you subsequently filled up?

This is the only time it has happened. I didn't try to restart it before adding gas and then filling.

My usual routine is to fill really full at the beginning of a ride, so it won't bubble over.

I would have to intentionally run it dry while riding with spare gas to see what it reads then.

I don't remember if I have run it down to it indicating that little remaining miles before.

 

[Chris09]

The first time I took TLCFTSA for a ride on the VStar, I did the same; I didn't actually run out of gas, but I couldn't figure out at 70 mph that I just needed to switch to reserve.
She was not impressed.

 

[dwalby]

I do admit that I'm a bit throttle happy at times, but I do feel that I should be getting better fuel economy. Historically, I do get a little less than average on most of the bikes I've owned.

here's a simple thing to check. On the #3 cylinder (right rear) there is a vacuum line that attaches to a fuel cutoff valve, which is located on the right side of the bike just rearward of the engine. That valve can develop a diaphragm tear and leak raw fuel into the #3 cylinder through the vacuum line, and eventually foul the plug. The combination of raw fuel and fouled plug can reduce your MPG, but when it happened to me it only dropped from 40 in town to about 35-37-ish. May not explain everything, but definitely worth a try. You can bypass that valve entirely, it will be obvious when you see the hose routing.

Also, where in soCal are you? If we're close by I could help you sort things out.

 

[DesmoRonin]

here's a simple thing to check. On the #3 cylinder (right rear) there is a vacuum line that attaches to a fuel cutoff valve, which is located on the right side of the bike just rearward of the engine. That valve can develop a diaphragm tear and leak raw fuel into the #3 cylinder through the vacuum line, and eventually foul the plug. The combination of raw fuel and fouled plug can reduce your MPG, but when it happened to me it only dropped from 40 in town to about 35-37-ish. May not explain everything, but definitely worth a try. You can bypass that valve entirely, it will be obvious when you see the hose routing.

Also, where in soCal are you? If we're close by I could help you sort things out.

Thank you very much! Sounds like it's a very quick check that I can do right away.

I'm in Thousand Oaks, about 5 miles from the Los Angeles/Ventura County line. Thank you for your offer... I'm a pretty decent wrench and hope to be able to sort things out without much difficulty. The only thing stopping me is time as I'm usually working on someone else's ride. But if you'd like to stop by for a beer or check out some pretty cool bikes, you are most welcome.

 

[increasing]

Ran out of gas? It's something I've been thinking about since buying the ST1100.

The gas tank is almost empty and I was thinking of running it as empty as possible of old gas before I fill it up again since it hasn't been used for a long time. The gas light isn't on yet but the gauge is way down, see picture. If I run it out of gas and have a gas can, will the gas vacuum valve let gas into the engine or will there be problems?

The best thing to do is maybe just fill the tank up again now and not run it empty.

 

[DesmoRonin]

Ran out of gas? It's something I've been thinking about since buying the ST1100.

The gas tank is almost empty and I was thinking of running it as empty as possible of old gas before I fill it up again since it hasn't been used for a long time. The gas light isn't on yet but the gauge is way down, see picture. If I run it out of gas and have a gas can, will the gas vacuum valve let gas into the engine or will there be problems?

The best thing to do is maybe just fill the tank up again now and not run it empty.

As a rule of thumb, depending on how old the gas is, if I cannot completely drain or siphon the old gas out of the tank, I will take out what I can, then fill the tank to dilute the small amount of remaining gas as possible rather than run the old gas through the fuel system. If the gas is very old and beginning to smell like varnish, I will remove the tank and drain/clean/condition as necessary.

 

[increasing]

You have a point there, there's no point in asking for trouble. The low fuel warning light works when the ignition is turned on, so it's fine.

 

[dwalby]

I'm in Thousand Oaks, about 5 miles from the Los Angeles/Ventura County line. Thank you for your offer... I'm a pretty decent wrench and hope to be able to sort things out without much difficulty. The only thing stopping me is time as I'm usually working on someone else's ride. But if you'd like to stop by for a beer or check out some pretty cool bikes, you are most welcome.

Ah, a bit far away from me for a quick get-together.

 

[Nile Newton]

Best I can 'calculate' on most ST1100s you have about a gallon+- left when the light comes on but this can vary from bike to bike.
And how much of that is 'usable' remains to be seen (I've not done any testing at that point).

Sounds about right to me. Every Honda that I have owned that had a low fuel light had about .8 gallons left in it when I got to the gas station. When the light comes on I figure I have 20 miles. So I pull into the next BP or Chevron.

 

[Al st1100]

Ran out of gas? It's something I've been thinking about since buying the ST1100.

The gas tank is almost empty and I was thinking of running it as empty as possible of old gas before I fill it up again since it hasn't been used for a long time. The gas light isn't on yet but the gauge is way down, see picture. If I run it out of gas and have a gas can, will the gas vacuum valve let gas into the engine or will there be problems?

The best thing to do is maybe just fill the tank up again now and not run it empty.

It runs with the gas thats in there so don't worry fill as needed. Fuel cools the fuel pump best not to run it low.

 

[Andrew Shadow]

The best thing to do is maybe just fill the tank up again now and not run it empty.

You said that it is running fine so the gas that is in the tank can not be that bad. You also said that it is almost empty. In this case you are much better off to fill it with fresh fuel and add some fuel system cleaner than to risk running out of gas. If it was running badly because of bad gas that would be a different situation but that isn't your scenario. Filling it up and riding the hell out of it will do it the most good.